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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

Okay, I get what you mean.

**In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.**

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**gAr****Member**- Registered: 2011-01-09
- Posts: 3,462

Okay, taking a break, see you later..

"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense" - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

Okay, same here. Thanks for stopping in.

**In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.**

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

**New Problem:**

**B and C get caught up in a game. They start with an ordinary deck of cards. C shuffles them and B guesses red or black, one card at a time. If B guesses right the card goes in his pile, if not the card goes in C's pile. After the last card each player counts his pile and pays the person with the most cards the difference between the two piles. They pay 10 dollars for each card. The piles are in clear view of both players at all times so there is no chance for mistakes. A game might go like this:**

**C's pile has 25 cards and B's pile has 27 cards. So C would pay B, 20 dollars because 10(27 - 25) = 20.**

**They play for a long time, B guessing and C dealing and B cleans C out. C runs home and gets more money. They play again and B wipes him out again. C runs to A and asks how this is possible.**

**A says) B was a great dealer and is obviously cheating.**

**B says) Nothing, since he is out buying things with C's money.**

**C says) How could he be cheating, he never touches the cards? I shuffle and I turn them up, one at a time. He should average 26 but he doesn't, he always has more!**

**D says) B should be horsewhipped for cheating you. Obviously the cards are marked on the back.**

**E says) Kaboobly doo, B just caught you on the 60 - 40 end of a proposition. Not only does he know he has the advantage, he must know how much of an advantage. In other words his expected return.**

**A and D say) Never mind her, Take a brand new deck and go play some more with him.**

**Do you like A and D's advice to C? With a new deck, what is B's expected value per game? **

*Last edited by bobbym (2013-02-09 23:14:56)*

**In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.**

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**anonimnystefy****Real Member**- From: The Foundation
- Registered: 2011-05-23
- Posts: 14,860

Hi bobbym

Here lies the reader who will never open this book. He is forever dead.

Taking a new step, uttering a new word, is what people fear most. ― Fyodor Dostoyevsky, Crime and Punishment

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

Hi;

I would imagine that B would use anything that was available to him.

*Last edited by bobbym (2013-02-09 22:59:15)*

I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.

All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.

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**anonimnystefy****Real Member**- From: The Foundation
- Registered: 2011-05-23
- Posts: 14,860

The question is hard!

Here lies the reader who will never open this book. He is forever dead.

Taking a new step, uttering a new word, is what people fear most. ― Fyodor Dostoyevsky, Crime and Punishment

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

Hi;

*Last edited by bobbym (2013-02-09 23:30:25)*

I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.

All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.

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**anonimnystefy****Real Member**- From: The Foundation
- Registered: 2011-05-23
- Posts: 14,860

I am nowhere near B's capabilities!

Here lies the reader who will never open this book. He is forever dead.

Taking a new step, uttering a new word, is what people fear most. ― Fyodor Dostoyevsky, Crime and Punishment

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

Heck neither am I but I am much better looking.

You probably do not know this old song, "Anything B can do I can do better."

I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.

All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.

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**anonimnystefy****Real Member**- From: The Foundation
- Registered: 2011-05-23
- Posts: 14,860

I do not know it. And I do not agree with its lyrics.

Here lies the reader who will never open this book. He is forever dead.

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

How do we go about solving problems of this type? How do we start?

*Last edited by bobbym (2013-02-09 23:51:14)*

I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.

All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.

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**anonimnystefy****Real Member**- From: The Foundation
- Registered: 2011-05-23
- Posts: 14,860

I am not sure. I am stumped by this one...

Here lies the reader who will never open this book. He is forever dead.

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

We work backwards from the answer to the question. That way we always have an answer.

It is okay to talk to yourself, it is even okay to answer yourself just as long as you do not say, "what do you mean?"

I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.

All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.

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**anonimnystefy****Real Member**- From: The Foundation
- Registered: 2011-05-23
- Posts: 14,860

But we do not have the answer...

Here lies the reader who will never open this book. He is forever dead.

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

Hmmmm. Is mathematics the only way to get answers? Are there any other tools?

I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.

All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.

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**anonimnystefy****Real Member**- From: The Foundation
- Registered: 2011-05-23
- Posts: 14,860

Of course, but I do not like simulating as an option. Might take too long...

Here lies the reader who will never open this book. He is forever dead.

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

Might take too long? When you do not have an answer it is the only option unless you are Carnak.

I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.

All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.

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**anonimnystefy****Real Member**- From: The Foundation
- Registered: 2011-05-23
- Posts: 14,860

Haha, well, maybe I will be able to solve it without that, like I do with most of your problems...

Here lies the reader who will never open this book. He is forever dead.

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

Hmmmm. Okay, post your solutions when you get it.

I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.

All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.

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**gAr****Member**- Registered: 2011-01-09
- Posts: 3,462

Hi bobbym,

"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense" - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

Hi gAr;

I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.

All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.

Offline

**gAr****Member**- Registered: 2011-01-09
- Posts: 3,462

"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense" - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

Offline

**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 82,681

Hi;

I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.

All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.

Offline

**gAr****Member**- Registered: 2011-01-09
- Posts: 3,462

Hi,

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

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