Math Is Fun Forum

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

Hi;

I do not know how to get A(z) either. In the book it is a 31th order polynomial.

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In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

123ronnie321

Member

Registered: 2010-09-28

Posts: 128

Re: What do you think?

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

Hi 123ronnie321;

You are making a good point. One that I overlooked. You, me and gAr will have to come back to this. Right now I am knee deep in confusion. So please bear with me.

---

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

gAr

Member

Registered: 2011-01-09

Posts: 3,482

Re: What do you think?

Hi all,

For that velocity, I considered the condition for only B (by mistake) .  Otherwise, it has no integral solutions.

Bobbym,

These are the changes I did:

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"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense"  - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

Hi gAr;

For that velocity, I considered the condition for only B (by mistake) .  Otherwise, it has no integral solutions.

That is what I did too. I forgot to check E's speed.

Thanks for showing me your answer. if you have the time would you check the coefficient of x^50000 using your method.

---

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

gAr

Member

Registered: 2011-01-09

Posts: 3,482

Re: What do you think?

Hi bobbym,

Okay.

I'm getting [x^50000] = 54445402801

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"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense"  - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

That is correct, so I guess you are interpreting that formula correctly.

---

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

gAr

Member

Registered: 2011-01-09

Posts: 3,482

Re: What do you think?

Yes, I had checked for [x^1000], [x^2000] and [x^3000], so I was almost sure about the formula. Also, [x^1000000] was very close to the approximation.

Very clever of them, pretty good closed form, isn't it?

---

"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense"  - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

Yes, very good. Donald Knuth is one of the best there is. The other two are just as good. How the form is derived is amazing.

---

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

New problem!

Warning! I suggest you leave this one alone. There is much disagreement and many traps.

An urn has 2 red, 2 blue, 2 green and 2 yellow balls. They are to be distributed into 4 boxes marked b1,b2,b3 and b4. Each box is to have 2 balls each.

What is the chance that all the boxes have no 2 balls the same color?

A says) Easy! 61 / 120
B says) I did not get that, I got 4 / 7 by counting them.
C says) I think that dummy B forgot that how you view a problem affects how you code it! A is correct as he usually is.
D says) I do not know about that code stuff, B and C sound like enemy agents. I got 27 / 50.
E says) C is partially right, 3 people programmed ( coded ) this and they all got different answers. I am going with B though!

What do you get and why?

---

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

gAr

Member

Registered: 2011-01-09

Posts: 3,482

Re: What do you think?

Hi bobbym,

Last edited by gAr (2011-05-01 16:48:19)

---

"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense"  - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

Hi gAr!

---

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

gAr

Member

Registered: 2011-01-09

Posts: 3,482

Re: What do you think?

Hi bobbym,

Glad to see you too.

I believe my first try is incorrect.
Here's another, which I did by cases.

---

"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense"  - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

Hi gAr;

---

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

gAr

Member

Registered: 2011-01-09

Posts: 3,482

Re: What do you think?

Hi,

Okay.

---

"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense"  - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

Hi;

What is the number you are getting for exactly 2 boxes having the same colored balls?

---

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

gAr

Member

Registered: 2011-01-09

Posts: 3,482

Re: What do you think?

There are 6 ways to have same colored balls in 2 boxes. Then use permutation with repetition.
Therefore, 6*4!/2! ways.

---

"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense"  - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

That part we agree on so far. How many for 1 box with the same colored balls?

---

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

gAr

Member

Registered: 2011-01-09

Posts: 3,482

Re: What do you think?

Okay.
That would be 4*4! ways.

---

"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense"  - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

Hi;

Of course there is no 3 boxes and 4 is 24. Do we agree?

---

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

gAr

Member

Registered: 2011-01-09

Posts: 3,482

Re: What do you think?

Hi,

Yes, that's what I get.

---

"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense"  - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

Okay so it is on the last thing that we are not agreeing. What is the total number of ways to arrange the 8 balls in the 4 boxes? Remember I think rb is the same as br.

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In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

gAr

Member

Registered: 2011-01-09

Posts: 3,482

Re: What do you think?

Because we need each box to have two balls each.

---

"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense"  - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."

bobbym

bumpkin

From: Bumpkinland

Registered: 2009-04-12

Posts: 109,606

Re: What do you think?

Hi gAr;

So you are getting 264. I have a program that is counting them, it gets 282. That is where we are not in sync.

My answer is

Which is close to yours.

---

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.
Always satisfy the Prime Directive of getting the right answer above all else.

gAr

Member

Registered: 2011-01-09

Posts: 3,482

Re: What do you think?

Hi bobbym,

That's a difference of 18 both in numerator and denominator.
So we need to check the case for different colored balls.

---

"Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense"  - Buddha?

"Data! Data! Data!" he cried impatiently. "I can't make bricks without clay."